I have a client who would like to put a very small wine tasting facility in the basement of his existing basement of his commerical building. The dimension from floor to floor jsts above is only 7ft. I am not seeing any exceptions in the Califl Historic Code, the Calif Existing Bldg Code or the CBC that anything less than 7'-6" is allowed. Am I missing something? Thanks all
Wayne; you are correct, occupied spaces, such as wine tasting, has a minimum ceiling height. Conversion (change in occupancy) from basement (storage?) requires compliance to current code.
Thanks Jim, that is what I thought, was just hoping for a loop hole. Oh well
I had a wild idea and thought I would throw it at you folks
Since the client would like to keep this rustic we are not covering the existing 2x10 floor joists above. So with that in mind could we not call the ceiling the floor sheathing above which is at 7’-9-1/2” AFF and call the floor joists above protruding objects (CBC 1003.3)? I know, I know, am I kidding? Hey, I am trying to think outside the box here. This would meet the requirements of CBC 1003.3.1 since the joists would only account for 10% of the total area which is well under the allowable 50% in the Code. Also notice, these protruding objects are allowed to extend down to 6’-8” AFF and we are at 7’-0” to the bottom of the floor jsts above. I am thinking (cannot confirm) that the 7’-6” min ceiling requirement is a requirement of the State Fire Marshal to maximize the time it takes for a room to fill with smoke. Bring a ceiling lower only lowers the time for it to take to fill a room with smoke. If it was a headroom issue, why would they allow 50% of the room to be covered with protruding objects? Well, what do you think? Have I lost my mind?
nice box! creative thinking!
The Bldg Official asked me to see what ICC's opinion on it was so I sent them the WHOLE thread between the BO and myself and here is their response
Wayne, pursuant to the detail, the ceiling height is 93 inches and the protruding objects (i.e., joists) are 84 inches. As such, the details appear to depict compliance with the requirements in 2012 IBC Sections 1003.2 and 1003.3.
Senior Technical Staff
International Code Council, Inc.
Chicago District Office
4051 West Flossmoor Road
Country Club Hills, IL 60478
awesome! great job!
Thanks Brent!!! Things still going well over there?
yep! while the rest of the nations was freezing, we just go to the beach.
We are not as warm as you but 79 today. We are still waiting for winter to arrive. Take care buddy
Out of the box becomes inside the box.
Let us know what the AHJ says.
Congrats on successful effort.
Well, the project got squashed because the building has a retail space at the other end of the building thus per California (1 retail = shopping center) it is now a shopping center which requires an elevator. Dang, so close.
Well, we learned that we can use a lift in existing buildings so the BO is good with that but now he not accepting the ICC interpretation as posted above regarding the ceiling hgt. He now wants opinions of other BO's. So, any feed back would be appreciated.
Curious, which agency are you dealing with?
got it, thanks.